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Soule or Marbles?
 

Soule or Marbles?  

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Mongo
(@mongo)
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A new Marlin 1895CB .45-70 is slowly making tracks to Mongo's spread and decision time is at hand.  Soule or Marbles tang sight?  I have read the Marbles (improved model) may impede on the Marlin's bolt travel & require folding down between cycles.  That would be an instant disqualifer if true.  The Soule seems to be more appropriate and I'm leaning toward the MVA brand, but which model?  The TRR 500yd range will be the max 'ol CB will shoot.

Thanks!

Mongo Slim

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Posted : 26/04/2018 7:59 am
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

Mongo,

The Marlin 1895 CB is a great rifle. My son and I both have one and use them regularly, but 500 yards is probably too much to expect to be practical with a lever gun.  Most folks limit them to a max of about 300 yards, but you can sure try if you like to.  When we have the long range match, we offer the option to shoot either a 250 yard (lever gun) or longer ranges with single shot rifles.

As far as sight go, the improved Marbles does not interfere with the Marlin rifle function.  I have one on mine and it works quite well.  It is, however, tricky to adjust for multiple distances during the course of a match.  Soule' sights are great, and MVA is one of the best.  However, you might also consider Lee Shaver sights (I've put a link below).  He has a very nice economy Soule for $225, much easier on the budget than MVA.  I recently put one of these on a rifle, and am very happy with it.

To take advantage of the Soule' type sight, you will also need a globe type front sight.  The standard bead on the Marlin is too large for accurate aiming at long range.

http://stores.leeshavergunsmithing.com/for-lever-action-rifles-1/  

http://stores.leeshavergunsmithing.com/17-series/

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Posted : 27/04/2018 3:52 pm
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Thanks, BPD!

     Very informative info & much appreciated.  A few questions come to mind:

1.  Does your Lee Shaver "tip" under recoil as suggested on their website, and if so have you noticed accelerated wear/tension slacking as a result?

2.  What Globe front sight do you recommend for the 1895CB?

3.  Do you recommend the addition of a globe front sight with a Marbles?

   Thanks again!

Mongo

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Posted : 27/04/2018 5:49 pm
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

The Lee Shaver sight does tip when firing.  I find it really isn't a problem, as I just tap it back upright with my thumb while chambering another round.  The globe front sight Lee Shaver sells works well with either type of sight - it is the 2nd link in my reply above.  Any other globe will also work, but his is very economical.  You just need one with a 3/8" (0.375") dovetail.  

I like globe sights a lot for improved accuracy, but it depends on what you plan to use the rifle for.  If you're going to use it for Cody Dixon or a little beyond (say 100 - 150 yards), I use a Marbles white bead, but the smallest bead they make, so it won't cover the target at longer ranges.  I have these for my Cody lever guns.  For more precise shooting or longer distances I'd use a globe sight.

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Posted : 27/04/2018 6:10 pm
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Great info.  Since the Marlin is limited to 250yds for the big bore lever class Marble's it is.  

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Posted : 28/04/2018 9:06 am
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

Mongo,  just to be clear - there is no rule stating that the lever guns are limited to 250 yards, just a "kinda accepted" rule of thumb.  You can shoot them as far as you like.

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Posted : 29/04/2018 8:16 pm
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

I can't seem to find any specs for Marble's standard tang sight max elevation limit on the 1895CB assuming a .500" front sight ht is maintained?  With the improved Marble's it would be fairly painless to change the staff but I'm leaning toward a 250yd max so if the standard Marble's will do that (Trapdoor level loads <1,400fps) I will go that route.  This rifle is specifically for the long range matches as I have my Uberti 1866 for future CD matches.

Thanks!

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Posted : 30/04/2018 10:12 am
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

It’s hard to set exact numbers for maximum distance with specific sight staffs, as it is so dependent on the cartridge and specific load. As I recall, I use the standard height staff on my Marlin 1895 CB.  My BP ammo runs slightly over 1200 ft/sec. 

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Posted : 30/04/2018 10:21 am
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Thanks, BPB....

I resolved my dilemma & maintained domestic tranquility by following your lead.  Our UPS delivery guy has developed a pronounced flinch upon encountering Mrs Mongo during his daily visits to our porch so I endeavor to reduce his (and my) exposure in this regard......The improved Marble's, standard staff, ivory 1/16" bead front sight, & folding rear leaf sight are ordered.  

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Posted : 30/04/2018 11:51 am
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

Sounds like a winner!

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Posted : 30/04/2018 12:37 pm
Rawhide
(@rawhide)
Active Member Registered

Just a little more info. At the State match you couldn't use the Soule sight in the lever action class. You would have to shoot against the single shot rifles. The Marbles sight was ok . Not sure if other ranges allow the Soule in the lever class. I have the Marbles sight and it works well in Cody Dixon class and long range lever class. I would suggest replacing the front sight with one that has interchangeable  inserts. I change mine when changing from Cody to long range. I would also recommend getting a front sight with the spirit level in it. Some folks have a tendency to slightly cant their rifle when shooting and the level will help correct that. Our range is pretty lenient about those things to help folks get started but if you plan on going to other matches you could run into problems. Good luck 

 

 

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Posted : 01/05/2018 2:02 pm
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Much obliged, Rawhide,

    Is the spirit level globe universally accepted?  I don't figure on shooting elsewhere but just curious?

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Posted : 02/05/2018 7:53 am
Rawhide
(@rawhide)
Active Member Registered

I've never seen it questioned before. Seems to be accepted. 

This was the first time I've seen the rear sight brought up. They may be tightening rules due to high interest. Just didn't want you to be caught by surprise. 

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Posted : 02/05/2018 8:11 am
RamblinGambler
(@ramblingambler)
Eminent Member Registered

I doubt anything is universally accepted when it comes to cowboy long range.  But I'll say this, we know the spirit level predates 1900 by a fair bit, so you have a good argument if anyone questions it.  If you run across someone who is adamant about the level being illegal, you can always hide it.  Some of them can be rotated so the viewing window is facing the other direction, or you can just put some masking tape over it. 

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Posted : 02/05/2018 10:26 am
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Thanks.  I do believe "When in Rome, do as the Romanians do" is excellent advice here.  

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Posted : 02/05/2018 12:46 pm
RamblinGambler
(@ramblingambler)
Eminent Member Registered

What's the difference in the two functionally?  Is the marbles sight just harder to adjust?  Does it have repeatable adjustments at all? 

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Posted : 03/05/2018 10:08 am
Rawhide
(@rawhide)
Active Member Registered

i think both sights were originally developed for hunting. The Marbles sight probably was made to fit in a saddle scabbard easier than the Soule. Just by their design the Soule sight is more friendly to quicker changes. If ya come out on Sunday I'll let ya shoot both my rifles and show you the differences for each sight. Sights can get very pricey so it's nice to try both before deciding which one will work best for your situation.

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Posted : 03/05/2018 10:50 am
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

The Soule has a scale inscribed bed on it for easier and more precise adjustment. The Marbles is adjusted by counting clicks up or down.

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Posted : 03/05/2018 12:44 pm
Mongo
(@mongo)
Eminent Member Registered

Well, the Marbles base finally arrived today & I immediately noticed a pronounced cant that made front & rear sight alignment impossible when using the tang peep.  Trusty Stanley laser line confirmed the Marble's post cant.  Base was secured with the stock screw only.

It took 2 layers of card stock "shims" to correct the cant & all sights laser perfect now.  Is this a common issue on these bases?  I'm tempted to stone the high side of the base but will probably just buy shim stock instead.  I don't want to locate & drill the second tang hole until it's fixed.

Advice appreciated!

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Posted : 16/05/2018 7:39 pm
Blackpowder Burn
(@blackpowderburn)
Eminent Member Moderator

Mongo, that is not at all normal for mounting a Marbles sight.  First, I've not had one mounted using only one screw.  The Marbles on my Marlin 1895CB has two screws.  Also, all of mine have mounted very straight and not required shims.

Is it possible that you got the wrong sight base?

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Posted : 16/05/2018 10:02 pm
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